It is often noted that the Scottish Episcopal Church is very much in favour of the Anglican Communion. What is noted in public slightly less often but which is no less important to remember, is that it is not in favour of the Anglican Communion at any cost. Our dismissal of the Anglican Covenant showed that very clearly.
The Archbishop of Canterbury’s statements yesterday in a radio phone-in, which seemed to imply that opening marriage to same-sex couples would lead to murder in Africa, take us into a very murky ethical place. I have to admit that my heart sank when I heard it. We have had more than enough of this kind of thing from inhabitants of Lambeth Palace. It seems very clear to me that in this case, Justin Welby is wrong.
Generally speaking, I thought it was a poor radio performance. Personally I never do radio phone-ins. It is a format that is hard to do well with. The Archbishop seemed nervous (perhaps rightly) and ill-prepared.
The particularly offensive thing which he has said is to suggest that there should be no movement on opening marriage to same-sex couples in the church because that could lead to Anglicans being murdered in Africa. He told a story of standing beside a mass grave and being told that the people had been killed by local opposition forces.
I’ve stood by a graveside in Africa of a group of Christians who’d been attacked because of something that had happened far far away in America, and they were attacked by other people – because of that a lot of them had been killed.
Inevitably, I’ve seen US friends posting a great deal online asking whether the Archbishop was trying to lay the blame for dead Africans at the doors of The [US-based] Episcopal Church. It is a repugnant suggestion and comes just before Justin Welby is due to visit that church next week. The Archbishop needs to justify his claim or withdraw it. It is a vile suggestion for a cleric to make of another part of the church.
I find the ethics of this very straightforward. It seems to me that the ethics of the Anglican Communion, of the churches in the UK, of the churches in North America, of the governments of the nations in which we live – these cannot be determined by those who bear the bullet and the bomb. The Archbishop of Canterbury seems to have been suggesting that our policies should be dictated by murderers.
In some ways this isn’t new. Justin Welby’s view is probably not that different to that of Rowan Williams and we’ve heard the same stuff coming from the Mothers’ Union for years. More than once I’ve heard it said that Rowan Williams was desperate for Jeffrey John to withdraw from being a bishop because he feared the consequences of violence in other countries. It can seem plausible put like that, can’t it? Who wouldn’t want to stop violence?
The trouble is, it is an attempt to deal with the reality and horror of violence by appeasing the violent. It is giving those who murder, a moral authority that they can never be allowed to hold.
Let us presume for a moment, for the sake of argument that the story told to Justin Welby is essentially true – that there is a mass grave in Africa caused solely by positive attitudes to gay people (a gay person?) in the US. If that is true then the only Christian response is to condemn the violence and do so publicly, loudly and endlessly. You don’t keep your mouth shut and try to turn the clock back on progressive attitudes on the other side of the world as a response to it.
The claim is that these people were killed because their opponents believed that if they left Christians alive then they would be “made gay”. If this is true then those people were killed as a result of homophobia. It is homophobia of the worst, most violent sort that killed the people in the Archbishop’s story.
You condemn it, Archbishop. That’s what you are called to do.
This feels very personal for me. In my work at St Mary’s I encounter very frequently people who come from Africa including some of the countries that are being discussed around the world because of this current conversation. I also encounter those who are gay and lesbian and particularly, I help those amongst them who want to get married, to get hitched. Am I supposed to prejudice the rights, livelihoods and wellbeing of one group over another because someone threatens one particular group with violence?
We are our own Anglican Communion at St Mary’s and I couldn’t possible care only for the rights of one group. We all have a right to life, to security, to live our lives to the full.
When you encounter violence, you condemn it, Archbishop. When you encounter murder, you condemn it, Archbishop. When you encounter homophobia, you condemn it, Archbishop.
You don’t appease it, Justin Welby. You condemn it.
Why should any of us in any land expect anything less of you?
There have been people prepared to commit violence in the wake of the ordination of women, in response to churches being racially integrated, or because of interfaith dialogue- and there still are, in our own country. By the Archbishop’s logic Christians should adhere to the most conservative mores possible in order to appease violent misogynists, and disdain Muslims to appease the BNP. “Someone might get angry” is never a good reason not to do something.
Very well said, Kelvin.
Archbishop welby position is right for us down here in Nigerian we don’t accept gay practice.we Christians should practice what is written in the holy bible cos God condemns gay practice.
Ever heard of David and Jonathan? One of the great samesex love stories — and it’s in the BIBLE. Please read it meditatively before replying.
Reading David and Jonathan as a same-sex love story is the same western cultural mistake that assumes that a male couple holding hands in India must be gay.
That cuts both ways – it could equally be centuries of homophobic cultural conditioning that allows anyone to think that David & Jonathan were “just good friends”.
Enough already on the David and Jonathan debate. It is way off topic.
The primate of our Anglican church in Nigerian made it clear to the church of England that they should show us were it is written in the Bible where a man should marry a man.biblical definition of marriage is the union between a man and a woman.please for the seek of God let us go back to our bibles.
So, you live by every so-called biblical law do you? err, no, because you’ve just cast judgement….
When I was at school I was bullied, very nastily bullied. It damaged me for life, not physically, because most though not all of it was emotional bullying. But mentally. For the rest of my life, I have been panicked by things other can cope with, avoided situations I needed to deal with and only slowly learned how to cope with problems that others found it simple to solve. The bullies always had a good reason. My shoes were wrong. I had no right to wear shoes like that. My tastes were wrong, my interests.
Were they wrong? Well I liked history, architecture, drama, comfortable shoes. But the fact is, the bullies were looking for somebody to bully. The reasons they gave were only justifications – the anger eating them, the hatred they wanted to act out, was the real reason.
Bullying is like that. And you never, ever, ever appease a bully, because the moment you, you strengthen their hand.
@ chigozie iwueke – I do not think the Bible condemns homosexual practise as we now have it, but if you think it does, I can accept that is your view. What I cannot accept is people being tortured, humiliated and murdered because somebody thinks they are homosexual. I cannot accept people being murdered because somebody thinks other Anglicans in another place have a homosexual bishop.
At every juncture in history appeasing the aggressor invariably has resulted in a one-sided escalation of aggression to the benefit of the aggressor. I do not doubt that the ABC was moved by his experiences in Nigeria. I do doubt the integrity of his statement as it would paralyse effective debate in the UK which would appease the right (and his own personal sentiment about being not pro-gay) to the detriment of the left and centre.
What this latest debacle has done is to remind us how ineffective/non existent the WWC is.
There is nothing Christian about crossing the road to avoid engaging with another’s suffering, and at this point it doesn’t matter what the source of the suffering is. What I find utterly repugnant is the speed with which the road was crossed and I suspect that that is because to do so, rather neatly, seeks to cut off debate about a subject evangelicals are so unreasonable about. And it’s a debate they will “lose”, ultimately. How many times have I read in recent months on Facebook and on Twitter the refrain from anti equality contributors, “We are tired of this debate. Let’s shift the focus to the poor, the hungry…” There’s nothing like changing the statement of the debate when you whiff the scent of defeat.
Welby didn’t miss the chance to condemn, did he? He had no intention of doing so. That’s why I was so angry this morning when I heard about this.
Chigozie I’m not Jewish, I’m Christian and none of my many Jewish friends (including Christian Jewish friends) believes what you do about what we call the Old Testament (including those who read Hebrew). I have many African friends and all of them have an AMAZING ability with languages even though they’re so humble they don’t boast about it. So here’s a challenge for you: learn Hebrew, then learn about all the different ways Jesus read the Hebrew bible. If you don’t have time for all that, read my little book ONLY SAY THE WORD (Google the title and my name). Lastly, don’t believe the word of a White man just cos he’s a pastor (or her written a book). If you don’t know who’s behind your country’s recent regulation then find out – and find out about your country’s history of religious colonisation. Africa was a more tolerant place before the White missionaries so it’s ironic that of my African Christian male friends the one who told me he was pushed downstairs by his brother, the one raped by policemen and the one who witnessed his boyfriend burned to death by a mob all said these violent people claimed to be Christian. That’s not very ‘turn the other cheek’ and ‘love your enemies’, is it, Bro?
chigozie iwueke,
can you explain to me why people think that our liberals views in the West are responsible for Christians being killed in Africa?
After all, most African Christians are like you, deeply conservative about homosexuality and the churches in Nigeria and Uganda have been driving the anti gay laws in those countries.
Christians and Muslims in most African countries are 100% agreed on this.
So why would anyone there even think of killing your Christians?
Alan,Erika and Rosemary pls am not in support of killing of anybody jus because they r gay or lesbians but what my bible condemns is homosexual u guys should read through leviticus 18:22,1Corinthians 6:9-11,leviticus 20:13.1Timothy 1:10,Christianity without practising what is written in the bible is not Christianity.Christianity is jus Christ like.am an Anglican and right from my days in Anglican children’s ministry we never learn that a man should marry a man but the bible made us to understand that man is between a man and a woman.you people brought the gospel to us in Africa made us known that some of our traditional Africa practices are condemned by bible which we dropped and today some of you in the west want homosexuality to be recognise in the church when the bible forbids it in total.homosexuality have no place in the church of Christ.
What else does it say in Leviticus Chigozie? Do you live or even try to live by all the laws written down in this book? Please stop taking scripture out of context.
Oh yes, both Alan Mcmanus and I could show the Nigerian bishop examples of where the original Hebrew in the bible indicated the presence and acceptability before God of same sex unions…
Mr Iwueke, I understand that you’ve been TOLD that the Bible verses you listed (leviticus 18:22,1Corinthians 6:9-11,leviticus 20:13.1Timothy 1:10) condemn same-sex marriage, but MANY highly learned Biblical scholars DISAGREE with this. Can you not accept that Christians of good-will disagree? Do you insist that we submit to your reading of the Bible, or are we allowed to read and interpret it for ourselves?
I grieve deeply for ALL victims of violence, whether that violence is anti-Christian, anti-Muslim, or anti-gay. Violence is NOT the will of God/Allah!