• Taint

    The Church of England has a problem. Well, the Church of England has many problems, but the one that it is waking up to at the moment is that women bishops are getting closer and closer to it and it hasn’t quite worked out what to do.

    Why does it have to do anything?

    Ah, well there exists a settlement in the Church of England whereby the Church of England does not fully recognise as bishops those bishops in the Anglican communion who have been consecrated in other parts of the Anglican world who happen to be women.

    Now this means that priests who have been ordained by such bishops cannot serve in the Church of England. All those claims that churches which allow the consecration of women as bishops make about being in full communion with the Church of England are deeply compromised by this.

    The election of a female candidate to the episcopacy in Ireland is a joyful thing. It is right, I think, that all positions in the church should be open to both men and women equally. I long for this to have become normal so that we can then get on with talking about what kind of episcopacy we think the church needs. We’ve got so hung up on gender that we’ve not really been able to talk much about episcopacy itself. I’m one of those pesky people who is a passionate advocate of equality in this area who also thinks that it will make very little difference to the leadership that the church receives. My belief that women and men can lead the church equally is founded in a belief that women and men have the same capacity for both glory and despair as one another. My training convinced me precisely that women and men in the church need equal opportunities because I saw that women in leadership positions in the church are capable of exactly the same cruelty as men.

    However I digress.

    I find today an excellent post has been published from Will Adam, editor of the Ecclesiastical Law Journal and Vicar of St Paul’s, Winchmore Hill in the Diocese of London on the recognition of orders. I was unaware that the Scottish Episcopal Church had a different legal position with regards to the Church of England to the churches in Ireland and Wales, but it is so. A Church of England bishop can apparently refuse to receive the orders of someone ordained in Scotland for any reason but not those from Ireland and Wales.

    However there also appears to be an argument in the same post (which  I have to admit I don’t understand with respect to Scotland) saying that there is be no way that a Church of England bishop could automatically refuse to receive the orders of someone ordained by a bishop who happens to be a women provided they come from within the British Isles, though they could be refused from elsewhere. (If I read that right).

    All of which must make Church of England legal types sit up and take notice.

    I’m interested in this not simply from a legal point of view though. Some people in Anglicanism believe that women cannot be ordained and refuse to receive their ministry. I don’t think I  very often encounter such people and in Scotland, our legislation on ordaining bishops is a done deal. If a diocese chooses a female candidate for the episcopate then that is that. If she has any problem ministering to anyone in her diocese then she can, if she thinks it will help, ask a colleague from the college of bishops to help her out. However, that is her choice and not anyone else’s. We don’t have legal “protection” for those who can’t accept women as bishops and we are not going to. And we thank God we don’t.

    Amongst those who can’t accept women there has developed this peculiar mentality which people refer to as a theology of taint. It is sometimes denied to be such, but the fact remains that there are some who won’t recognise the ministry of those who have been ordained by women, never mind the women themselves. It looks like a theology of taint and it sounds like a theology of taint and frankly to me it is precisely a theology of taint.

    What I’m interested in is that with respect of our current bishops in Scotland, all of them have either had a female co-consecrator present at their consecration, joined in consecrating someone with a female co-consecrator present or have been consecrated by someone who has had a female co-consecrator present at their own consecration.

    What I wonder is whether those who apply the theology of taint believe that anyone at all (bishops, priests or deacons) now ordained in Scotland is legit.

    Oh, and by the way an English bishop was present and joining in when this situation began. I was there – I saw it with my own eyes.

    Where does this leave the Scottish Episcopal Church in relation to those who would deny the legitimacy of women to act as bishops?

    (The bishop who happens to be a women who joined the SEC for a consecration was a delight and I attempted to teach her the gay gordons).

    Do we, or do we not, remain in full communion with [all of] the Church of England?

7 responses to “Eucharistic Prayer”

  1. Stewart Avatar

    Another great clip Kelvin – The singing is great.

    I found myself singing along with the Santus and Benedictus.

    Please more of the service. The cathedral always sounds great when the a large congregation is being supported by the organ. The snippet of “All people that on earth do dwell” to the tune of Jerusalem on the BBC website leaves me wanting more.

  2. ryan Avatar
    ryan

    Yeah, I think ours are the best (although I heard New Zealand’s are lovely too). Who actually writes these things? The then-bishops themselves? Artistic clergy? I can see why they would want them to be written in house but (personally) I think it would be great , in the future, to approach notable writers/poets to do them (Edwin Morgan!) irrespective of belief, and have them checked for theological accuracy by someone appropriate.

  3. Caron Avatar
    Caron

    Do you know, I always thought the 1970 Liturgy was best and I couldn’t come to terms with the modern stuff. I might be more open to persuasion than I thought.

    The atmosphere at the service must have been wonderful and it does come across in the video clip.

    As for the angel – thank you so much for having that attitude to a baby. Others are not so tolerant.

  4. John Penman Avatar
    John Penman

    Totally agree on the excellence of the modern Scottish Liturgy. Having had to suffer the Roman Rite and the ASB when working in Englandshire and occassional exposure to Common Worship (which is both), it was nice to come back to what was/is “simply the best”. Being picky tho, we took a wee while to get there: 1982 was the 1st Eucharistic Prayer – the other 4 were authorised in 1990! Like Caron I was a 1970 fan, but exposure to the Blue Book has made it much more “home” for me.

  5. Eamonn Avatar
    Eamonn

    I agree that the 1982 Liturgy is unbeatable. Every time I visit the C of E or the C of I, the liturgies used seem (with respect) to have yawning gaps in them.

    Caron, the 1970 Liturgy has strengths if you want the underlying theology spelt out in propositional statements. The 1982 service more often expresses the theology through imagery, which to some of us speaks more eloquently. As it happens, a bishop who is a published poet was involved in the drafting.

  6. MadPriest Avatar
    MadPriest

    “Now, what do you want next”
    Have you got any Simpsons, or maybe an early Torchwood episode?

  7. Thomas L W Graham Avatar
    Thomas L W Graham

    Just visiting these sites for the first time. What a wonderful innovation to include all these video’s and sermons etc on the web. Hope the enclosed donation is of some assistance.

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