Here’s a video of a conversation I had with one of the members of St Mary’s last Sunday. Andy Winter was chatting to me about the way treatment and perception of HIV has changed over the years. We talked about new PrEP medicines, reducing stigma and the extraordinary news that the epidemic could be ended by 2030.
Take a look here:
I think you have understood if correctly (or at least as fully as it can be understood).
This just shows how confused the church has become, or how keen it is to tie itself into the proverbial knots to appease both progressives and traditionalists.
Either way, this position is both absurd and intellectually unsustainable.
Kelvin can I ask what submissions you are referring to, is there a new one?
I think that, once marriage law is passed, current civil partnerships can convert to marriage by filling form, etc. Don’t think they said what happens if the couple want a religious marriage – or did I miss that?
If our churches persist in saying no to marriage, wouldn’t it be better to do the blessing after they’ve converted their civil status – as in some countries where every marriage is a civil ceremony, and any religious service is done afterwards
I hope everyone has completed the most recent consultation paper
I think that the church wants to have its cake and eat it too. It wants everyone to be happy, and this is probably the best way that it knows to do this.
Is it ridiculous? Of course.
There is to be a new one. I’ve not seen it. I understand that the position that the Faith and Order Board is holding to is that “church teaching” is what Canon 31 says – that and nothing else and therefore we are doctrinally against change.
Is that not the case?
So far as I understand it, the SEC has not moved in its position since the first response at all.
The first response included this:
Question 10: Do you agree that the law in Scotland should be changed to allow same sex marriage?
The Canons of the Scottish Episcopal Church (Canon 31) state that the doctrine of the Church is that marriage is ‘a physical, spiritual and mystical union of one man and one woman created by their mutual consent of heart, mind and will thereto, and as a holy and lifelong estate instituted of God’. In the light of that Canon, there is no current basis for agreeing that the law should be changed to view marriage as possible between two people of the same sex.
The SEC’s last response was in line with what the current law was, indeed still is, this consultation asks a very different question. To which the answer ‘well it isn’t legal, so we can’t say’, (I paraphrase) can’t be the answer this time, can it?
Of course Canon 31 also states it is a “lifelong estate” but had clause 4 added at a later date to allow for divorce and remarriage.
I was watching the evidence to the Westminster parliamentary committees the other day. In all these things, even from churches which are prepared to be tentatively in favour, or declining to be opposed, what is missing from all the evidence is the human experience of joy and delight that actually characterises a true and good wedding, of any combination of partners. How can we get across the compelling and converting happiness when processes take the form they do?
Is there any way of getting hold of the board – of ordinary church members getting hold of it and making it listen?? I mean I know my approach tends to lack in subtlety what it makes up for in directness, but then, well, it is very direct.
Rosemary, of all the many beautiful sentences you have written, that is the very very best.
I wonder what is the first thought that comes into your head when you open an invitation and find yourself invited to a wedding. Do you say a wee prayer of thanksgiving for the couple? Maybe you do. Do you rejoice that two people have discovered that they love one another and give thanks for…
Just back from the Consecration of the new Bishop of Brechin in Dundee. Brechin may be one of the smaller dioceses in the Scottish Episcopal church but they like their pomp. Where else would the clergy procession have begun in the Council Chamber and made its way to the Cathedral accompanied by flying thurible and…
Off to Brechin for the consecration of the Diocese of Brechin’s new bishop. Will report later. The Diocese of Brechin was famously referred to by one of its former bishops as The Flagship Diocese of the Scottish Episcopal Church. Which only makes one wonder about the most appropriate sobriquets for the other six, doesn’t it?
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