What is in Kelvin's Head?

  • Public Opinion and Same-Sex Marriage – John Curtice

    A while ago we had a real treat at St Mary’s. Prof John Curtice gave a talk about public opinion and same-sex marriage. It was one of those forums which was very special for those who were there. There simply isn’t anyone who knows how to read and interpret public opinion as John can and it was great to see him in action.

    It was also one of the first forum meetings which I videoed. Unfortunately, the talk that John gave was fantastic but the audio on the video was terrible. Lots of people tried to listen but some were quite disappointed. For that reason, I was delighted that John agreed to give a similar, though slightly updated, talk to the diocesan synod that we held here in the Diocese of Glasgow and Galloway on 1 March 2014. Once again, John was gracious enough to allow it to be videoed and this time the audio is tip-top, thanks to Kennedy Fraser’s work on the sound-desk.

    This can be posted freely. I suspect that it may help far more people in the church get their heads around where public opinion lies on this question than were at the synod the other week. Do share and use on other blogs and diocesan websites. And take a look – it is well worth putting aside half an hour to watch.

    Now the question for the day, is – in what ways does public opinion matter when the churches make their minds up about same-sex marriage?

    , ,

10 responses to “The end of the World”

  1. agatha Avatar
    agatha

    Mildly serious question that has never occurred to me before. Why does she still get called the Virgin Mary when Jesus had brothers she presumably had in the normal way?

    Reply
    1. kelvin Avatar
      kelvin

      Well, there are those who try to make the case that she remained “ever” Virgin and that the reference to Jesus’s brothers is an oblique and more general reference to the men of the extended family – cousins, uncles and so on. I think that’s rather silly myself.

      The Blessed Virgin Mary is simply one of the titles afforded her because of the persistent story of Christ’s birth. For myself, I think there is more interesting theological ground to be ploughed by thinking of her as exemplifying a virgin world waiting in longing and expectation for God to come. That kind of thing seems to me to be considerably more potent than birth-story tittle-tattle.

      Reply
  2. Rosemary Hannah Avatar
    Rosemary Hannah

    When I was young I was sure the birth story was ‘just a myth’ – but then as I got deeper into history I got more experienced at evaluating stories. Not, you understand, ‘form-critical’ experienced, but historical experienced. What now strikes me with force is that two very different writers tell very different stories about the birth of Jesus with very different genealogies. However, despite the two birth stories coming from markedly different traditions, both bill Mary as a virgin. In any other context, I would find that more than convincing. So here, too, I let myself be convinced. As a sober historian, and cynic, I find it the most probably explanation. Not the only historically possible one, just the most generally convincing.

    Generally, I find historical thought more satisfying than the more circular arguments of form criticism. I am fairly sure I could use form criticism to disprove the fact that David Cameron is currently the PM.

    Reply
  3. agatha Avatar
    agatha

    Thanks – I have no problem with the virgin birth, its been humanly possible for decades now so I reckon God could have arranged it easily enough a couple of thousand years ago.

    Reply
  4. Rosemary Hannah Avatar
    Rosemary Hannah

    Well, actually it is NOT humanly possible – even with IVF. You cannot get a boy baby, humanly speaking, without a father. But then, humanly speaking, bodies do not resurrect, and walk and talk and eat…

    Reply
  5. agatha Avatar
    agatha

    Rosemary, I think you are being a bit technical. Where I come from a virgin is someone who hasn’t had sex.

    Reply
  6. Rosemary Hannah Avatar
    Rosemary Hannah

    The problem is that it is not the ‘having sex’ but the chromosomes in the baby. Or to put it another way – how did Jesus get his X? It is easy enough to get pregnant without ‘having sex’ but harder without ‘having sperm’. Despite that, the evidence is that two unrelated stories believe it was done. And two unrelated stories believe the babe was born in Bethlehem. Very interesting.

    Reply
  7. Agatha Avatar
    Agatha

    From God?

    Reply
  8. Rosemary Hannah Avatar
    Rosemary Hannah

    Sperm from God? Not I think, stories ‘from God’ except in the general sense that all understanding is divine. No. Stories from history. And the biology? Truly beyond current understanding. But, here you have it – if one understands it ceases to be amazing and people say : ‘Now we understand, that is not a miracle and Jesus is not form God.’ And if we do not understand, people say: ‘We do not understand and so it cannot have happened, and Jesus is not from God.’

    Reply
  9. Agatha Avatar
    Agatha

    If I didn’t believe God could knock out a few sperm as and when required I would have Sunday mornings free.

    Reply

Leave a Reply

Your email address will not be published. Required fields are marked *

Previous Posts

  • Correction

    I’m so glad I posted that announcement on Sunday. In conversation with someone else in the diocese yesterday about it, I discovered that another church was also making plans to have the visiting bishops on 13 July in the evening. A mix-up has led to the same event being planned in two different churches at…

  • An Announcement

    We had a fabulous service this morning in St Mary’s. The place was full of people, good preaching, gorgeous music (Haydn’s Little Organ Mass with organ, full choir and strings) and a glorious time was had by all. We ran out of service books and consecrated hosts (again). At the end of the service, I…

  • Synod – Ends

    All is over for another year. Last night’s synod dinner was very enjoyable. The Caledonian hotel does us proud. This morning, the business ended unusually early, though not before an interesting debate from the Standing Committee on the organisation of the church. All over for another year. Except for those of us on the Organizational…

  • Synod – membership

    We have a debate about how to define the membership of the Scottish Episcopal Church. Sally Gorton speaks against changing our current rules. She has done so before. Alan Thornton speaks against giving anyone other than the Rector the role of keeping the role.  I think. John Armes speaks of the importance of keeping involvement of those …