• The #syriavote is not so simple really

    Like many people in the UK, I spent much of yesterday dipping into what was happening in parliament as a long debate took place as to whether this country should engage in military action against ISIL in Syria.

    I once had aspirations to be an MP and that always makes me wonder which division lobby I would have walked into when these moments of national drama take place.

    In this instance I am almost sure that I would have walked into the nay lobby – I’d have voted against extending military action in Syria.

    However, I don’t find this a simple question. It is far more complex than my twitter feed seems to be suggesting. And this morning I’m not rushing to add #notinmyname hashtags to everything. This is a case where I can see merit on both side of the question and I find that my gut reaction which is to be against military action is more pragmatic than ideological.

    I happen not to be a pacifist. I am not a pacifist because I think that sometimes there are evils that may need to be defeated by force. The obvious and classic example is that I think that the allied forces were right to be deployed to defeat Nazism. It was an ideology that threatened all of Europe with its evil. Some things are worth fighting against.

    It is my suspicion that ISIL is something worth fighting against that would have made me pause before casting a vote had I been in parliament last night. I find myself having sympathy with Hilary Benn who identified the threat from ISIL as being the fascism of the day. So many of the same themes emerge – death to the Jews, death to the gays, murderous sectarianism and a direct opposition to democracy. The fact that it now uses terrorism on Western streets and wickedly distorts Islam for its own ends shouldn’t blind us to the fact that we’ve seen fascism before and have believed it should be fought.

    And that’s why I can see that there’s a case for action.

    My problem is largely because I can’t see the action being particularly likely to succeed which is one of the conditions of using force in just war theory.

    I can’t really see that there’s a plan for post conflict rebuilding of Syria yet. I can’t really see how another two bombers will make that much difference – the Americans have been bombing ISIL targets for months and don’t seem to me to have solved the problem. It is inevitable that civilians will die in this action. It is difficult to believe that the action will meet the test of proportionality. I also don’t really believe that you can bomb ideas out of existence.

    And so I find myself believing action to be wrong for pragmatic reasons whilst believing that ISIL should be confronted for ideological reasons. And that would have given me a terrible dilemma has I been in parliament.

    Two things emerged yesterday which I found contemptible. Firstly the Prime Minister’s assertion that those who were against action were terrorist sympathisers. It was beneath the dignity of his office to make such a claim and he should have apologised. Secondly, those who are trying to co-opt this question for the sake of Scottish Nationalism. It should be beneath our dignity as the people of Scotland to co-opt this terrible decision for our local politics. Whether one likes it or not, Scotland chose to remain part of the UK and the UK parliament has made a decision. Being democrats means that sometimes we have to respect the democratic decisions that are made that we don’t like. That’s what being a democrat actually is. That means those who don’t like the result of the Scottish Referendum need to accept that the people of Scotland made an informed choice. It is our parliament that made the decision last night – a decision I happen to find it difficult to support. It is a parliament that the people of Scotland chose to remain a part of. Using ISIL to make cheap nationalist points in this country appals me. If we don’t accept democratic decision making (the referendum, the workings of parliament in which we are all represented etc) then we begin to lose the moral right to stand against the forces which rage against democracy wherever we encounter them.

    We encounter them in ISIL. The question at hand is how to oppose them.

    Last night I think that I would have voted against the government and against the use of force in Syria. However I would have done so with a heavy heart. It is just possible that after listening to the debates I might have voted with the government and for the use of force against the evils of ISIL. I would have done so with an even heavier heart though I would have done so hoping that if my own land was being conquered by fascists, then other countries would intervene.

    That’s why this issue is more complex than my twitter feed seems to find it.

16 responses to “St Andrew's Day 2008”

  1. Christina Avatar
    Christina

    On a related theme, was there not a year recently when we had to move the assumption because it fell on Ash Wednesday? I don’t remember Christmas being delayed, but of course, can’t comment on the delay of the second coming.

  2. Christina Avatar
    Christina

    And I know I meant “annunciation” before you point it out to me.

  3. Rob Murray Brown Avatar
    Rob Murray Brown

    Is there a reason that the two celebrations cant be held on the same day? Do you really think that Christ would object to sharing a day with one of his disciples. I think not!

  4. kelvin Avatar

    I think that it is more about giving the church the full opportunity to concentrate on both.

    The themes that we remember at Christ the King (ie how Jesus undermines all our expectations of monarchy and power) don’t fit terribly well with theme we think about on St Andrew’s Day (thinking about missions and spreading faith in the world and also praying for Scotland). Advent 1 is something else altogether and also does not make a good fit.

    I quite like the way the calendar works as it is a good reminder to us that being God’s people is something that happens daily, not weekly.

  5. Rob Murray Brown Avatar
    Rob Murray Brown

    Im feel sure that your congregation would manage to digest more than one message on any particular day. The fact is that St Andrews Day is on the 30 November each year – every 7 or so years this will fall on a Sunday. I cant remember it ever being moved before and see no reason to start in 2009.

  6. Kelvin Avatar
    Kelvin

    St Andrews Day is on 1 December this year in the Scottish Episcopal Calendar as it is every year when 30 November falls on a Sunday.

    It is the way the Ecclesiastical calendar works.

    To quote fully from the published Calendar:

    Each Holy and Saint’s Day listed in the Calendar has been assigned a number which indicates its category.
    It is intended that feasts in categories 1 – 4 (below) should be kept by the whole Church. Days in categories 5 and
    6 may be kept according to diocesan or local discretion. Commemorations not included in this Calendar may be
    observed with the approval of the Bishop.
    When two celebrations fall on the same day, the following table indicates which takes precedence.
    1 Maundy Thursday, Good Friday, Holy Saturday;
    Easter Day (and the weekdays following);
    Pentecost;
    Ash Wednesday; Monday, Tuesday, Wednesday in Holy Week; Ascension Day;
    Christmas Day ; Epiphany;
    Sundays of Advent, Lent and Easter.
    2 Feasts of The Lord (Naming, Presentation, Annunciation, Transfiguration);
    Trinity Sunday; All Saints’ Day;
    Dedication and Patronal Festivals;
    Eves of Christmas and Pentecost;
    First Sunday after Christmas;
    First Sunday after Epiphany (the Baptism of the Lord).
    3 Sundays after Christmas (except Christmas 1);
    Sundays after Epiphany (except Epiphany 1);
    Sundays after Pentecost (except Pentecost 1);
    Weekdays in Lent.
    4 Feasts of the Apostles and Evangelists;
    Saint Mary the Virgin, the Visit to Elizabeth;
    Joseph, John the Baptist (Birth, Beheading);
    Mary Magdalene; Michael and All Angels;
    Stephen, the Holy Innocents;
    Kentigern, Patrick, Columba, Ninian, Margaret of Scotland.
    5 All Souls’ Day; Holy Cross Day;
    Conception and Birth of Mary, Mother of the Lord;
    Thanksgiving for the Institution of the Holy Communion (Corpus Christi);
    Thanksgiving for Harvest.
    6 Other commemorations.
    Notes:
    (i) Epiphany may be kept on the Sunday following 1 January, and the Ascension on the Seventh Sunday of
    Easter.
    (ii) Feasts in Category 2, falling on a weekday, may be kept on the nearest Sunday, except Sundays in
    Categories 1 and 2.
    (iii) Feasts in Category 4, falling on a day of higher category (other than a weekday in Lent), should be
    transferred (in chronological order) to the next available weekday.
    (iv) Where feasts in Category 4 fall on a Sunday (other than a Sunday in Categories 1 and 2), they may, if local
    circumstances require, be kept on that day.
    (v) The weekdays of Advent and Easter may be given special weighting.
    (vi) When days in Category 6 coincide with a day of higher category, they should be omitted that year.
    (vii) Thanksgiving for the Institution of Holy Communion is particularly associated with the Thursday after
    Trinity Sunday.
    (viii) Thanksgiving for the Harvest may take place on any appropriate Sunday.

    The full thing can be found within this zip file:
    http://www.scotland.anglican.org/media/liturgy/liturgy/calendar_and_lectionary_pdf.zip

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